News Club Interview: “It's the biggest reality TV show in the world"

Arthur Sinodinos on a second Trump term

It’s been a fortnight since it became clear that Donald Trump would be the next President of the United States - again. 

Upon his victory, conversations within my social circle seemed to indicate a fair degree of shock that someone like Trump could not only be elected once but again. Some might say that shock is naive, ignorant even. However you view it, it happened. Twice. 

So what’s going on? Well, there are reams and reams dedicated to answering just that question. For you, we thought it might be sensible to wait until the dust settled somewhat and the heat came out of the moment and then sit down and speak with someone level-headed but experienced. 

That person is Arthur Sinodinos. 

Arthur has been involved in and around politics for his entire career. He was PM John Howard's chief of staff (1997-2007), then a senator and minister (2011-2019). And importantly, he was Ambassador to the US for part of Trump’s first administration. 

He has had a career dedicated to politics and policy - and understanding the public. He thinks very practically about how the public might vote. Without too much emotion throughout our conversation, he’s able to help us understand what is going on in the US. 

For example, I ask him whether a portion of Americans just don’t want to see a female leader - ever. I ask him about the people around Trump - people like Elon Musk and how powerful he is.

And we talk about Trump himself. What’s he like in person, and how best to handle someone Arthur describes as “transactional” and a “dealmaker”. 

If you’d like to listen to this conversation, you can tune in on YouTube here - and hit subscribe while you’re at it.

Highlight #1: On ends justifying the means

Arthur Sinodinos: There’s a school of thought with politicians that their private behaviour can indicate their likely public behaviour or actions. Except for what seems to happen with some politicians, and maybe Trump falls into this category, people see them as an instrument for getting X or Y done. And therefore, in a sense, the ends justify the means. So if you're an evangelical, even though you may object to his moral persona, if he's going to stack the Supreme Court and get you the decisions you want, is that a transaction you're prepared to make? And the field evidence in the US is that people have been prepared to make that transaction.

Highlight #2: One the difference between America and Australia

Arthur Sinodinos: We are patriotic, but we're more casual about it. And to some extent, I think we're a bit suspicious of people who are too intense about these things. Whereas there's a real intensity to the patriotism and everything. And I think what also comes through in economics and business is how intense they are in the US. Another bit of difference is the capacity to take risks, which in part may come back to whether there’s a social safety net. 

Highlight #3: On Tim Tam diplomacy

Arthur Sinodinos: People in the US run a million miles from Vegemite. I mean, they look at it, and they think, what is this? Is this sort of motor grease or something? With Tim Tams, you're more likely to get people to take up on that offer. So what we used to do when we had dinners at the residence was that when it was dessert/coffee time, they’d have a Tim Tam with their coffee. That was the ultimate decadence. 

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